After studying pages 132-3 of WTL until I was dizzy, I couldn't be sure whether these two were the same or slightly different. I plumped for a pair of Small Blood-veins but my guru Ben Sale of
Essex Moths prefers Small Scallops. After staring at them again, I still just wonder whether the one above might be an SB-v and the one below an SS. Can one of the wise end my suffering?
While on scallops, do you remember the story alleging that Sir Keith Joseph went into a Yorkshire chippie at election time and, noting that scallops cost 20p, told a reporter that things couldn't be that bad with those sort of prices. A scallop in that context, however, is not a shellfish but a jumbo chip in batter. I'm not sure that I believe it either.
Look in particular at the shape of their hind-wings, Martin, and compare them to the images in the field guide. The top one is indeed Small Blood-vein and the lower one is Small Scallop. In each case the resting posture of the forewings is also typical, with Small Scallop holding them forward of the head while Small Blood-vein doesn't.
ReplyDeleteHi Martin, in addition to Dave's comments the fascia (cross lines) and the position of the stigma (black dots) are diagnostic. The Small Blood-vein has the discal spot between the inner and middle cross lines on the forewing and between the middle and outer cross lines on the hindwing. The Small Scallop has the discal spots on the fore- and hindwings between the same cross lines.
ReplyDeleteThanks so much again, Dave and Nigel. I feel almost cheerful! I felt that they were different but didn't have the confidence to go for SS for the second one on the basis of the WTL pictures. Given time, I usually try Hants Moths Flying Tonight or Google Imaging in these circs but your diagnoses are extremely helpful. So maybe there's progress! All v best M
ReplyDeleteIsn't your second picture an excellent match for the WTL picture of a male Small Scallop? It has no middle darker cross line, so is not Small Blood-vein. Adding to what Dave & Nigel have said, the outer cross line is more wavy and not parallel with the wing margin in Small Blood-vein. In Small Scallop the line is more-or-less parallel to the wing margin and gently curved rather than wavy. Having said all that, they are normally very obvious from wing shape and posture.
ReplyDeleteThanks too, Martin. I fear that obviousness is in the mind of the beholder! But I take your points and they're very useful All best as ever, the other Martin, or rather one of the other Martins
ReplyDeleteFinal comment - Ben Sale meant that just the lower one was a Small Scallop so we're all in agreement and, agin, thanks for all help
ReplyDelete